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Post by froggy54 on Mar 28, 2011 18:32:29 GMT
Hi Fusioneers,
I would like to know if anyone already tried to relace the 80 Gb IDE hard disk with a SSD drive.
It seems to me a IDE SSD 64 Gb drive (not too expensive) and a 5$ 2,5" to 3,5" converter could do the job.
Loading times would be ridiculous, power consumption would be decreased, there would be no disk noise and no heat dissipated.
I might try it but before spending 150 €, I'd like to be sure that any failed experience has not been tempted.
Thanks to all
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jiffy
Junior Member
Posts: 253
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Post by jiffy on Mar 28, 2011 19:17:24 GMT
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Post by Shreddie on Apr 14, 2011 0:56:49 GMT
I'm sure I remember one of the former members here trying this... It didn't work for him.
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Post by Jesse on Apr 15, 2011 2:35:59 GMT
Hi Fusioneers, I would like to know if anyone already tried to relace the 80 Gb IDE hard disk with a SSD drive. It seems to me a IDE SSD 64 Gb drive (not too expensive) and a 5$ 2,5" to 3,5" converter could do the job. Loading times would be ridiculous, power consumption would be decreased, there would be no disk noise and no heat dissipated. I might try it but before spending 150 €, I'd like to be sure that any failed experience has not been tempted. Thanks to all From what I read that some SSD drives are data only, you would need an SSD drive that is bootable - that may only be true of the earlier SSD drives. You can get an IDE to SATA connector an use a SATA SSD drive, once I start working again (hopefully in the next 2 to 3 weeks) that's what I would like to try. I also want to install a swappable SATA drive enclosure to replace the internal IDE drive so if the hard drive goes bad I don't have to disassemble the Fusion to replace it. |
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Post by Jesse on Dec 10, 2013 14:18:17 GMT
Some thing to consider when trying to use a SATA Hard Disk or SSD drive whether you try the external SATA connection or use an IDE to SATA connector internally SATA drives are either
SATA I 1.5 Gb/s
SATA II 3.0 Gb/s
SATA III 6.0 Gb/s
The drives probably should be jumpered to SATA I 1.5 Gb/s in order to work with the Fusion.
This can be done on hard disk drives, I am not sure about SSD drives.
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Post by davidmusik on Dec 13, 2013 20:50:48 GMT
Hi, I'm French and it's my fisrt post here, then hello to all ! I'm interested for SSD Drive too, I don't know if this link can help but this manufacturer approve the SSD I comptability : www.corsair.com/support/faq/solid-state-drives/Perharps a good track ! Sorry for my english |
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Post by Jesse on Dec 14, 2013 5:32:50 GMT
Welcome David, a working SSD drive in the Fusion is a nice thought, but I am not sure it will happen. every once in a while someone takes a stab at it, but no luck so far.
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Post by mstsfreak on Dec 15, 2013 0:42:41 GMT
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Post by parametric on Dec 15, 2013 3:23:34 GMT
I did try some stuff a while back on this subject but was not successful. I tried a 64Gb Samsung SSD SATA, using one of the many IDE PATA <>SATA converter boards. The cabling was a bit of a lash-up - due to the scarcity of MALE IDC sockets for CABLE fitting. (they are usually found on PCBs) - so my lack of success MAY have been due to that . . . . I would guess that chances of success would be better with a PATA drive - One less hoop for the Fusion's bios/OS to jump through! I noticed this one: www.ebay.co.uk/itm/300745325553?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649I successfully upgraded an ASUS EEPC 901, C: and D: drives from 4GB + 8GB, to 32GB + 128GB, using mini pci-e sata SSD drives from this seller. They were both Kingspec drives. As you say - prices have come down, so I might revisit this project again in due course . . . I DID also have a go with the Fusion's external sata socket, but had no joy either. The socket IS connected internally, but I did hear that it was never implemented in the final "build". This is curious, as the Service manual shows pics of the display addressing an external drive in the run-through of the Diagnostics Menu . . . . Perhaps it was never left switched on in the bios in the final build? disappointing really . . . parametric Attachments:
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pev69
Junior Member
Posts: 66
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Post by pev69 on Jan 7, 2014 12:17:42 GMT
I have also experimented with the external SATA connection, with HDD and SSD. In diagnostic mode it shows the correct info (under HD info) of a couple of extra HDDs I have, which is nice and proves that Fusion's SATA connector works but is just not utilized in the main firmware as an alternative drive. BUT with my older Intel 80 GB SSD (SATA 2) the SATA connector does not give any info in diagnostic mode either (shows: No drive), which is kinda strange, it should work the same as with the HDDs. Lately I tried something deeper, as follows. The Fusion's SATA connection is implemented with a PATA to SATA bridge chip (JM20330), which is on its own PCB and connected with an IDE cable to the Digital Expansion PCB (as it is named in the schematics in the service manual) just as the HDD is. And those two IDE interfaces (named IDE0 for SATA and IDE1 for internal HDD) seem identical. This gave me the idea to swap the internal HDD's IDE connector with the SATA PCB's connector and see if a SATA drive could then function as the main HDD. But no success, it just gives a "floating bus" error both when booting and in diagnostic mode's HD info. I suspect this is due to the SATA PCB having a weird connection with the bridge chip's POR (Power-On Reset) pin. It is not connected to the normal POR (named System Reset) signal of Fusion's main PCB, but instead is connected to a separate I/O pin of the "Recording engine" DSP. And this through a normally unconnected wire (pin 32) in the IDE connector! I might still try soldering a wire from the main PCB's POR signal to the SATA PCB's POR (and of course first disconnect the current connection) to see if then it could be used with a SATA HDD as the main drive, but don't know if I can gather enough strength to do this  But anyway more on topic, the fact that the SATA connection identified a HDD but not an SSD (in diagnostic mode) seems to weigh heavily against the possibility of using an SSD in Fusion. I do not understand what it could be that causes this though. |
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Post by Jesse on Jan 7, 2014 20:00:44 GMT
Good research an information, also as SATA drives are normally only connected one drive to an interface how does this come into play? Perhaps that is why the Fusion SATA adapter is connected to IDE 0. It's really strange and maybe never got past beta testing for the SATA port. Also note that the IDE cable is a 40 pin 80 wire cable, that's a good thing. Attachments:
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Post by parametric on Jan 7, 2014 22:17:52 GMT
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pev69
Junior Member
Posts: 66
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Post by pev69 on Jan 8, 2014 7:57:01 GMT
Jesse: The Fusion's IDE interfaces are connected to an FPGA, so I do not think they can be much compared to the "normal" IDE connections that were used in PCs. I suspect they are only very narrowly conforming to IDE standards, just enough to make a hard disk work with it, and they are "one drive per cable" already. The SATA bridge is set (through hardwired mode selection pins) as Master and 100 MB/s fixed UDMA rate (for the IDE side, the SATA side has no configuration). So this could be assumed also for the HDD IDE1 connection. The 80-wire IDE cable is necessary beyond 33 MB/s speeds to ensure reliable operation. parametric: Yes, a PATA SSD might have a better chance as you said. But my thinking on the other hand was that by using the already existing PATA to SATA adapter in Fusion, the IDE side would be already configured properly, and since the SATA side has no configuration options this might ensure compatibility. But maybe this was a wrong idea since the diagnostic mode did not recognize the SSD, only HDDs (from the external SATA). Also it could still be hinging on the SATA generation as Jesse mentioned earlier, although SATA is supposed to be fully backward compatible. So if somebody could find a SATA 1.0 SSD this might be worth a try. I already closed my Fusion again because I have no room in my apartment to keep it opened. I still think the POR signal thing might be worth investigating, I will try to that at some point. At the least it would give a cost-free way to put a SATA HDD in Fusion (if the original were to break, PATA HDDs are becoming rare) since the external SATA cannot be used anyway.
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Post by Jesse on Jan 8, 2014 18:09:01 GMT
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pev69
Junior Member
Posts: 66
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Post by pev69 on Jan 8, 2014 19:09:23 GMT
Yeah, Fusion actually has two of those FPGAs and much of the control and data signals are routed through them which means that firmware upgrades could change very much of what the Fusion can do. It is a very, very flexible and marvellous architecture! On that note, I have studied Fusion hardware quite a lot and made this block diagram (in MS Visio 2007, a PNG version attached) to visualize the overall architecture a few years back when I got the service manual. Sorry the image is quite large but I could not find a better way to preserve good readability. Attachments:
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